The mods of all the major communities there remove comments criticism Hexbear and usually follow it up with a ban. It’s absolutely clear what is happening and it shouldn’t be allowed to continue.

  • A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.worldEnglish
    61·
    6 months ago

    I’ve been saying this for like 6 months.

    .ml is just a filter for Hexbear and lemmygrade users to infiltrate the greater federated instances.

  • assassin_aragorn@lemmy.worldEnglish
    51·
    6 months ago

    Well, the discussion in this thread has convinced me to agree. It’s also readily apparent that ml thinks any criticism against them is because they’re leftist. They can’t fathom that anyone could think they’re an asshole or authoritarian apologist.

    • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.eeEnglish
      41·
      6 months ago

      They don’t think that, they aren’t actually leftists and they know it. They’re masquerading as leftists and using that as a cover for spreading authoritarian propaganda. It’s intentional, they know precisely what they’re doing.

      If you try to talk to them about it they’ll argue in bad faith and try to waste your time.

  • taaz@biglemmowski.winEnglish
    4·
    6 months ago

    Welcome to federation, where basically every instance is a proxy to all others.

    Btw you are also free to block any instance yourself.

    • Ech@lemm.eeEnglish
      5·
      6 months ago

      Unfortunately blocking an instance only blocks posts on that instance, not users from it, which is the main issue people have with those instances.

      • Draconic NEO@lemmy.worldEnglish
        2·
        6 months ago

        Yeah it’s a very common misconception, I find it weird that people are still having it though when 0.19 is widely available.

        Maybe they’re just saying it as a way to be dismissive of the issue, this kind of stuff happens often when people report or call to attention malicious instances or malicious users.

          • ArxCyberwolf@lemmy.caEnglish
            01·
            6 months ago

            nor how letting a large, poorly moderated instance run wild can negatively affect discourse on the entire platform. Before Hexbear was defed’d on lemmy.ca, Lemmy was damn near unusable on many threads because of the spam and trolling. Blocking them doesn’t stop them from bothering those who haven’t and it affects the platform as a whole.

            • Draconic NEO@lemmy.worldEnglish
              2·
              6 months ago

              Blocking is not a real solution, it is putting a blanket over the problem and pretending it went away. People who suggest you do that are suggesting you enable bad faith actors by ignoring their behavior, as opposed to reporting it and/or making others aware so they can report it. We all need to work better to make the platform and spaces on it better, if no one works at it, nothing gets better.

              • ArxCyberwolf@lemmy.caEnglish
                1·
                6 months ago

                Exactly! Letting problematic instances poison the well leads to a net negative to the platform.

                • fine_sandy_bottom@discuss.tchncs.deEnglish
                  2·
                  6 months ago

                  My unpopular opinion: Federating with everyone by default is not sustainable.

                  It’s inevitable that the lemmyverse will shatter, and everyone will be better for it.

                  Instances will develop their own policies around moderation and behaviour, and federate with other instances with compatible policies.

                  Basically, federation only works if everyone is acting in good faith. It wouldn’t take much for a single entity acting in bad faith to fuck the entire fediverse presently.

                  Presently admits are blacklisting the bad faith instances. That’s going to change so admins whitelist compatible instances.

      • Clay_pidgin@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        0·
        6 months ago

        I use Connect for Android, and when I block an instance it blocks the users too. Their comments are still here, but sort of spoiler tagged.

        • fine_sandy_bottom@discuss.tchncs.deEnglish
          1·
          6 months ago

          Yes but surely you can understand that even votes from these poorly moderated instances are distorting the discourse elsewhere in the lemmyverse.

          Just because you can’t see it does not mean the problem is solved.

          • matcha_addict@lemy.lolEnglish
            12·
            6 months ago

            So we wanna defederate to steer votes in a certain way? Worrying so much about votes is such redditor behavior.

            • fine_sandy_bottom@discuss.tchncs.deEnglish
              4·
              6 months ago

              I would challenge you to think about how votes can influence the culture of a community.

              You’re correct in that worrying about how many upvotes you can accumulate is very reddit.

              I’m not really talking about karma accumulation, but rather the way votes can influence visibility of comments. When done methodically, this promotes some ideas over others, and presents an illusion that “everyone else thinks so”. This is a very, very powerful way to influence a community.

              We are hard wired to absorb the opinions of those around us. Sure you can disagree with other group members, but even that is an acknowledgement that the alternative perspective you’re disagreeing with is a popular one.

              You could absolutely influence people’s opinions on lemmy just with a hacked instance that manipulated votes on comments by just a few dozen points.

              • matcha_addict@lemy.lolEnglish
                11·
                6 months ago

                You make valid points. Apologies for the Reddit accusation.

                But the one thing that comes to mind is that this kind of Communist, like in lemmy.ml, is not big enough to cause this sway.

                Sure, the instance is massive, but most users don’t hold those same beliefs. Most people go to it as the “default” instance. So I really don’t think they have the numbers to cause this issue.

                • fine_sandy_bottom@discuss.tchncs.deEnglish
                  3·
                  6 months ago

                  Sure. This thread is talking about lemmy.ml, but I’m talking about the current state of the lemmyverse.

                  I’ve posted this elsewhere in this thread but my unpopular opinion is that federation by default is not sustainable.

                  Presently admins federate with everyone and blacklist those which are problematic.

                  It’s inevitable that in the near future someone with a rudimentary understanding of hosting will be able to spin up a dozen instances, each with a few thousand bot accounts, intent on upvoting every “genocide Joe biden” comment.

                  The fediverse will shatter. Admins will realise they need policies to guide their own moderation, and acknowledge that they can only federate with specific instances with compatible moderation.

                  So instead of blacklisting bad instances, you need to change to whitelisting good ones.

      • we is doomed!@lemmy.worldEnglish
        01·
        6 months ago

        I think thays a good compromise. if you then have an issie with a particular user you can block them individually.

    • Draconic NEO@lemmy.worldEnglish
      3·
      6 months ago

      Btw you are also free to block any instance yourself.

      Not how the instance blocking feature works. it’s a common misconception because people don’t read the docs and just assume it does what they think it does. From the News Section on Join-Lemmy:

      Users can now block instances. Similar to community blocks, it means that any posts from communities which are hosted on that instance are hidden. However the block doesn’t affect users from the blocked instance, their posts and comments can still be seen normally in other communities.

      It’s not an alternative or replacement to defederation, not even close. I’m really surprised this misconception still persists even after widespread adoption of 0.19.x across the Lemmy network.

      • bouh@lemmy.worldEnglish
        04·
        6 months ago

        So you don’t care about the instance you want to ban all the users from there. That’s quite open minded and tolerant!

            • fine_sandy_bottom@discuss.tchncs.deEnglish
              12·
              6 months ago

              Can we stop this please?

              It was never that revolutionary in the first place - “if you allow assholes to be assholes everything will go to shit” - I’m shocked.

              … but now, after seeing it as a reply to every second comment on lemmy, it’s just spam and doesn’t inform discussion in any way.

          • bouh@lemmy.worldEnglish
            03·
            6 months ago

            You can block instances for yourself instead of blocking them for everyone.

            • fine_sandy_bottom@discuss.tchncs.deEnglish
              2·
              6 months ago

              Good lord. It’s as though you haven’t bothered to read any other comments in this thread.

              Blocking instances yourself doesn’t solve anything. At all.

              • Draconic NEO@lemmy.worldEnglish
                2·
                6 months ago

                Of course they didn’t, they’re just reactively replying to comments that trigger them hoping that the people they reply to also get triggered. They are a troll.

        • Draconic NEO@lemmy.worldEnglish
          1·
          6 months ago

          @bouh@lemmy.world Lol look at you seething away, came here just to randomly attack people in a defederation thread.

          I know what triggers these types of responses to defederation, many people believe that the Fediverse was some grand user choice and free speech haven. Which is an incorrect assumption, by a long shot. The fediverse since it’s beginning has never been a free speech platform, and also like all other top down servers prioritizes admins, the people who pay the bills and are liable for what happens on their server. So when servers violate these rules and all other options have been exhausted or it is clear that they will continue causing issues persistently, servers are defederated to maintain the peace and safety of their server. One thing to make clear is that all users have the choice of signing up to a different server that does federate, and if they are the victim of one of these compromised/bad-faith servers, they really should consider doing that.

          That’s quite open minded and tolerant! Paradox of Tolerance

          • bouh@lemmy.worldEnglish
            12·
            6 months ago

            I’m merely pointing the hypocrisy here. Some people on lemmy.world are litteraly on a witch hunt.

  • jabjoe@feddit.ukEnglish
    41·
    6 months ago

    Ah! That makes sense. I was on world news of Lemmy.ml and the comments where full of nutters and/or troll farms. It was like gote/gout (or whatever it was called), another Reddit alternative I’ve tried that seamed to fill Nazis kicked off Reddit. I unsubscribed and blocked.

    Edit: Voat! That was it.

  • Extreme Soup@lemmy.worldEnglish
    41·
    6 months ago

    Seems like they werent such big fans of your post. It has been removed from their instance and your account was banned. Very interesting 🤔

  • IndustryStandard@lemmy.worldEnglish
    2·
    6 months ago

    ml and Hexbear definitely don’t have the same users. Their comments look very different. Hexbear is far more extreme in every way.

    • wesley@yall.theatl.socialEnglish
      31·
      6 months ago

      Hexbear is mostly just trolls in my experience. They like to brigade any discussion involving Russia, China, Ukraine, etc.

      Lemmy.ml is full of tankies that will also go out of their way to defend Russia and China but they aren’t just blatant trolls which is the difference.

      Having controversial opinions isn’t the problem, trolling and brigading are

      • stoly@lemmy.worldEnglish
        2·
        6 months ago

        This is also my take. Hex will troll you but ML folks actually think that you are an evil person because you don’t agree with them on some minor point.

        • TimewornTraveler@lemm.eeEnglish
          3·
          6 months ago

          actually think that you are an evil person because you don’t agree with them on some minor point.

          Right, this is the major issue for me. I am here for the community. This site doesn’t have half the content that Reddit has. We’re here on principle with each other. If you aren’t trying to make some kind of a connection with me as a person, if you get lost in some singular bullshit nonsense comment I wrote at 10AM on an idle Tuesday, if you start to attribute beliefs and opinions to me that I don’t have, if you’re not willing to reconcile and coexist, then I have no interest in engaging with you. Makes it real hard to engage with some folks - especially Hexbear.

      • bdonvr@thelemmy.clubEnglish
        03·
        6 months ago

        I wonder who they were trolling and brigading in the years of their existence prior to them federating with anyone…

    • ArmokGoB@lemmy.dbzer0.comOPEnglish
      2·
      6 months ago

      I would need pretty convincing evidence to believe that the major .ml communities don’t have at least one mod each with a Hexbear alt.

  • h3ndrik@feddit.deEnglish
    1·
    6 months ago

    At some time we have to deal with this.

    Keep in mind that we like Lemmy for being a federated platform.

    I don’t think there is enough awareness at this point. And the way we do it here, it has to come from the community. The people and mods have to become aware and make a decision to move their participation and the communities to another instance. I don’t see a way around that. This will take some time, patience and effort.

    I’ve started to do my part and unsubscribed from !Fediverse@lemmy.ml I’m now going through my list of subscriptions and find alternatives to other communities, so I don’t contribute to the lemmy.ml communities being the larges ones any more.

    [Edit: Wow. I’ve replaced 32 communities, some with substantially better alternatives, and I’ve found a few nice additional ones in the process. I still need recommendations for alternatives to: “Peertube”, “Libre Culture”, “Crawling the IndieWeb”, “datahoarder”, “Linux Phones”, “postmarketOS”, “osu!”. I’m glad I did this. I think this is the way to make a change as a simple user. And now I’m not part of the problem anymore. It took me the better part of an hour, though.]

    • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.eeEnglish
      2·
      6 months ago

      I’m just blocking the entire lemmy.ml instance. I’ve seen consistent problems from them, and nothing worth staying connected with.

      Wish I could help you find alternative communities but I’m not sure about the ones you mentioned. They’ll grow over time if Lemmy survives.

      • h3ndrik@feddit.deEnglish
        1·
        6 months ago

        Thx. I found the most important communities to me. I’m glad most of them have an alternative and those are going strong. I can live with losing a few minor ones.

        Concerning “blocking them”: I’m not sure. I was a strong opponent to the whole defederation and “safe-space” thing last year. Where especially beehaw.org decided to do their own thing and rigorously defederate, often preemptively and without talking to people. I think such behaviour splits the community and disconnects people. I really don’t like all the drama, falling out with each other and particularism. And I think all the feud is a sure way to kill the platform before it even took off with the general public… Honestly, I’m slowly changing my mind. Give me some more time.

        • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.eeEnglish
          1·
          6 months ago

          I agree with your general point but

          splits the community and disconnects people

          They aren’t people like you and I. They’re paid shills at best and KremlinGPT at worst. I think to survive and flourish as a platform Lemmy will have to aggressively fight back against authoritarian disinformation. As it stands, I won’t even admit to anyone that I use it because it so full of propaganda.

          • TragicNotCute@lemmy.worldMEnglish
            1·
            6 months ago

            I think saying that any group of humans “aren’t people” isn’t being respectful of others. Please stop.

            • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.eeEnglish
              1·
              6 months ago

              Intentionally misunderstanding what I said at best, defending propaganda from genocidal authoritarians at worst.

              • TragicNotCute@lemmy.worldMEnglish
                03·
                6 months ago

                I don’t care about the content of what you are talking about. The community rules say to be respectful of others. And you aren’t. I asked you to stop but you want to argue.

                • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.eeEnglish
                  1·
                  6 months ago

                  I don’t think shills are people on here in the same way genuine users are, I stand by that. They’re representing authoritarian governments, not themselves.

                  If you want people to be respectful of others, how about addressing shills who are defending the Kremlin’s genocide in Ukraine? It would be respectful to Ukrainians to acknowledge all of their suffering and close the door on propaganda from their oppressors.

          • h3ndrik@feddit.deEnglish
            0·
            6 months ago

            It is a bit more nuanced than that. There are normal people there, too. It’s been one of the largest instances when the Reddit exodus happened. Some of the users chose the largest and the ‘official’ instance. And some of them are still there.

            But lemmy.ml is operated by the same people who also run lemmygrad, some moderators seem to be the same. And unfortunately the whole Lemmy software platform is developed by “those” people.

            I don’t mind leaning a good amount to the left. I think a few socialist values would advance society and economy. Especially in places like the USA. And I’ve been called a communist for that. But being a tankie is beyond my comprehension. Why would anyone like Putin, defend the CCP and what they do to people. And I’m not overly bothered with the left vs right. It’s the constant yelling, being super argumentative, doing brigading and spreading misinformation.

            I think things are changing. I’m paying attention now to the usernames in the comments. And lemmy.ml isn’t the dominating place anymore. Most of the usernames I see come from a broad range of instances. And that’s a good thing. It’s still a home to some big communities which needs to change, too. And I’m also waiting for a new software to come along, written by different people with a different motivation and agenda. In my opinion that’s one of the next steps to emancipate ourselves. I mean if you don’t like lemmy.ml you probably don’t like the people making the decisions there. Which unfortunately are the same people who also write all of the Lemmy software. And their software development decisions reflect the same attitude. But also that’s going to change. A few people are working on good alternatives which strive to listen to the community, invite people to participate and also finally implement proper moderation tools and a few other tweaks to foster good behaviour.

            I like Lemmy. But this platform had a hard time from the start. And it’s still struggling. Mixing technological difficulties and innate problems of growing a community with drama, bad decisions, waywardness and friction within the community on many different levels is just stupid and unnecessary. But I’m still waiting for progress and a bright future. I think Federation is one of the best approaches with some potential to make that happen.

            I think the solid technological basis is what I’m a bit more concerned as of now. But apart from that I agree that it is us, the community who sets the tone and we decide who we want to listen to, nice people or people with behaviour disorders and an attitude. And it’s a vicious circle. At some point a platform has an image and is bound to tip and attract more like-minded people and less normal ones. And the dynamics are there and we need to actively fight for a nice place.

            • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.eeEnglish
              1·
              6 months ago

              Well said, I agree with all of that. I’m considerably more to the left as well, that’s part of why I hate lemmy.ml, because they’re preventing actual good growth and movement in that direction.

              Hopefully Mbin or some other one of the new forks/platforms takes off soon. I’m ready to move if necessary, I love the idea of a healthy Fediverse and I hope some day I can recommend it to friends instead of being too embarrassed to admit I use it because of all the propaganda.

              • assassin_aragorn@lemmy.worldEnglish
                0·
                6 months ago

                That’s something I’ve recently realized. They think people dislike them because they’re leftist, but that has very little to do with it. Some of their harshest critics are from the left.

                They have no idea it’s because of their authoritarian simping, and every time you call them out on it, they deflect. Frankly they more strongly support fascist regimes than their criticizers.

                • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.eeEnglish
                  1·
                  6 months ago

                  I think the paid shills know what’s going on, they’re told to act like leftists and probably don’t actually hold those beliefs. They might be brainwashed to think the CCP/Kremlin is good.

                  So in my opinion they pretend people are “upset that they’re leftist” in order to avoid people focusing on their actual motives.

              • wakumul@lemm.eeEnglish
                02·
                6 months ago

                you can leave literally any time. there are dozens of instances, you don’t need to stay on flagship instances. you might like truth.social, which runs mastodon’s software, or gab.com which does the same.

          • hark@lemmy.worldEnglish
            12·
            6 months ago

            “Everyone I disagree with is a shill and all ideas I disagree with are propaganda”

            • fuckingkangaroos@lemm.eeEnglish
              21·
              6 months ago

              Mocking me instead of responding to what I said is a good indicator you have no reasonable response.

              • hark@lemmy.worldEnglish
                02·
                6 months ago

                It’s a good indicator that what you said was worthy of mockery. Mockery is a reasonable response for someone who thinks everyone you disagree with is a shill and that all ideas that you disagree with are propaganda.

                • h3ndrik@feddit.deEnglish
                  1·
                  6 months ago

                  Well, they’re a bit over the top and oversimplifying things in my opinion. But you’re also not contributing anything of value. You could instead add your perspective if it’s different. I mean I’d probably read it and it’d get us …anywhere?..

                • Sybil@lemmy.worldEnglish
                  01·
                  6 months ago

                  all ideas that you disagree with are propaganda.

                  all media is propaganda.

  • daniskarma@lemmy.worldEnglish
    43·
    6 months ago

    Lemmy.ml is a massive instance. I don’t really know where are you posting there, probably in political communities and thus this reaction. But I follow lots of communities that are hosted on Lemmy.ml and they are just normal communities about their topics, normally technology. I certainly do not want to lose those communities of having to move my accounts around just because you had some problems with some particular people. Block them yourself and move on.

    I don’t get why there’s always people in small places that are always doing their best to make them even smaller. Lots of goods things are lost this way. We must be clever in trying to preserve and make this good things thrive. And, believe me I’ve been in lots and lots and lots of small community driven projects, this kind of attitude is no good for them. You cannot take every small issue you have with some part of the project and say: “we do not work together anymore”.

    If there’s an issue let’s be constructive about it. But defederation of such a big instance with so many people and communities that just does not care about this drama… I don’t see how that helps lemmy as a whole.

    I suppose there’s a lot of political ideology behind what’s being ask for, and what’s being said. So I do not expect convince OP of anything, as those hard as steel political beliefs are inmutable. But I hope sanity and a wish for making Lemmy a big project of the kind of social networks we want in the future will prevail. Even if that means sharing space with people you don’t politically agree 100% about everything, because that’s how a community works, different people working together.

    • diplodocus@lemmy.sdf.orgEnglish
      1·
      6 months ago

      I’ve seen inter-Lemmy drama posts in this comm before, and the mods deleted them (or locked them—I don’t recall).

      It’s hard for me to believe the mods haven’t seen this post. They’ve probably gotten multiple reports.

      It seems they’re making an exception this time.

    • ArmokGoB@lemmy.dbzer0.comOPEnglish
      43·
      6 months ago

      The fact I got an instance ban means the admins were involved and were endorsing the tankies. The problem exists at the highest level of Lemmy.ml, not just in a handful of communities.

  • Socsa@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
    54·
    6 months ago

    Moreover, it seems pretty clear to me that .ml intends to keep their finger on the scale as much as possible. Just saying “oh federation solves all the problems just block them” doesn’t really fix the issue when there are a bunch of ways they can potentially run malicious versions of the code base to mess with how federation functions and hold onto their influence. For example, they are already refusing to federate their mod logs in some cases, and they’ve shown themselves to be completely shameless and hypocritical when it comes to banning any and all dissent. They simply cannot be trusted.

    I personally believe that the broader fediverse should seriously consider taking serious steps to cut out .ml before they do something drastic to fuck it all up

  • catch22@startrek.websiteEnglish
    21·
    6 months ago

    If they weren’t such weasels and actually agrued back rather than just ban people like the spineless dimwit twats they are, I’d say the argument that they are easily filtered holds. But given they are just looking to propagate their shilling for Russia, trump (and they definitely do this) etc… fuck em!

      • catch22@startrek.websiteEnglish
        0·
        6 months ago

        Jesus fucking christ, this has comments talking about trump living rent free in muh libs heads

        https://hexbear.net/post/2090983

        You’re the same pack of fucking incels mixed in with the same russian shilling from 2016, that post was from an hour ago, took me seconds to find it

          • catch22@startrek.websiteEnglish
            11·
            6 months ago

            I really can’t be bothered going and finding all the pretty fucking obvious examples of you shitheads either apologising or glorifying putin, or coming out with pure incel stuff, or platforming trump. Which makes sense given it seems to be the same campaign as before, and its pretty fucking obvious at this point, very sloppy… I’ve clearly hit a nerve lol. It’d be great if you all could change track at this point and stop platforming that odious cunt, don’t worry I know there is unfortunately no option to stop shilling putin…

              • catch22@startrek.websiteEnglish
                01·
                6 months ago

                Assuming you’re not paid or being forced to do this, you must know you’re being used as a tool for the fascists you claim to despise. Platforming trump is support and I see there is no mention of the direct relationship to Putin in all the very loud refuting of this support…

                • Sybil@lemmy.worldEnglish
                  1·
                  6 months ago

                  I thought the Mueller report exonerated him. anyway it’s not as though anybody’s supporting Russia or Putin or Trump in these comments. we just know the Democrats are bad and aren’t afraid to say it.

      • Socsa@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        12·
        6 months ago

        If you can’t see how hexbear is mirroring trump rhetoric almost word for word then I don’t know what to tell you.

        • Eldritch@lemmy.worldEnglish
          01·
          6 months ago

          Are they mirroring trump rhetoric. Or is trump regurgitating talking points from his fascist idol. And ML are just so cultish, indoctrinated, anti West that they couldn’t not attack the west. Even if Russia is more clearly in the wrong on this issue.

          It’s more likely than them actually supporting trump. Honestly I think the only possible way you could say they support trump. Is that they understand that trump would destroy Western society and they approve of that. No matter who gets hurt in the process. Well actually when it comes to leninists it’s all about hurting people in the process really.

    • rambaroo@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
      0·
      6 months ago

      Pretty damn rich coming from lemmy.world where you ban people for criticizing Biden

      All you dummies do when you ban and defederate is push more and more people into extremist communities.

    • 4am@lemm.eeEnglish
      11·
      6 months ago

      Yes, leftists famously LOVE Donald Trump 🤣

      This is the most Reddit radlib shit I’ve seen over here yet. Grow up my dude

      • Draedron@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
        1·
        6 months ago

        Hexbears arent lefties. They are hiding behind acting like they are lefties while at the same time sucking up to the most fascist regimes on earth.

      • Deceptichum@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
        22·
        6 months ago

        Lemmy.ml are tankies first and foremost. They’ll defend anything that Russia/China thinks is good.

        Calling them leftists is an insult to the rest of us who aren’t authie chuds.

  • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.worldEnglish
    11·
    6 months ago

    I predicted this when lemmygrad got defederated. I said that neoliberals were gonna identify some other instance as the “tankie instance” and start campaigning to defederate from it.

    • Deceptichum@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
      11·
      6 months ago

      Funny because it’s always been those 3 instances this whole time, nothing ever changed in our dislike for them.

      • DragonTypeWyvern@literature.cafeEnglish
        11·
        6 months ago

        As long as we all agree you don’t actually care about rule violations, you’re just mad they think differently than you.

      • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.worldEnglish
        11·
        6 months ago

        Uh huh. Once you’ve succeeded in defederating from .ml, in a few months, there will be another instance that neoliberals decide is full of tankies, and it will have always been those 4 instances.

        I called it last time and neoliberals don’t change their desire to silence people to their left.

          • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.worldEnglish
            11·
            6 months ago

            And .ml is only the “tankie instance” because neoliberals found “tankie” to be an effective cudgel to silence people to their left. They don’t have to be tankies to get the label.

            • Deceptichum@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
              11·
              6 months ago

              Right, but I am AnCom call them tankies because they support the USSR & China.

              You can hate neolibs all you want, that doesn’t change the fact that CTH, Lemmygrad, & .ml are the tankie trifecta.

              • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.worldEnglish
                01·
                6 months ago

                CTH? I thought Hexbear was the first “tankie instance”

                See you when you guys get the urge to karen another instance.

                • Deceptichum@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
                  11·
                  6 months ago

                  Hexbear is CTH.

                  When reddit banned CTH, some of the community went and made Hexbear, most of us stayed on reddit and due to the small userbase it become an incestral breeding ground that removed all but the most hardcore tankies and authiechuds leading to the shitheap it is today.

  • BrikoX@lemmy.zipEnglish
    0·
    6 months ago

    Rules in question stated as a reason for removing the comments and temporary ban:

    1. No bigotry - including racism, sexism, ableism, homophobia, transphobia, or xenophobia. Code of Conduct.
    2. Be respectful, especially when disagreeing. Everyone should feel welcome here.

    People can make their own conclusions.

      • Lath@kbin.earth
        0·
        6 months ago

        bigotry
        ˈbɪɡətri
        noun
        obstinate or unreasonable attachment to a belief, opinion, or faction, in particular prejudice against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group.

        If the person in question went after them simply because they are part of the group called ‘tankies’, the first rule was broken.
        If the person in question was the first to throw out insults, the second rule was broken.

        If however the opposing group initiated the conflict, broke the same rules and was not punished, then the complaint here is fair and should be pursued in order to prevent an escalation of abuse.

        …

        The nasty thing about bigotry is that by definition, it doesn’t matter which group is being discriminated against. It accepts all discrimination under its label.

        • gedaliyah@lemmy.worldEnglish
          0·
          6 months ago

          We generally don’t consider something to be bigotry if it is directed at an ideology or behavior that people can control. Ability or disability, gender, religious/ethnic background, race, age, nationality, etc. are all factors that are beyond an individual’s control.

            • Deceptichum@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
              21·
              6 months ago

              Of course not. They apply their rules subjectively.

              For instance I got rule 1’d for saying “Fuck China” but I bet you, you wouldn’t get banned for saying “Fuck America” or “Fuck Israel” (fuck ‘em all imo).

      • h3ndrik@feddit.deEnglish
        0·
        6 months ago

        Can you give us the name? I think just spreading FUD isn’t really helping and I also can’t do anything about it without more information.

      • woelkchen@lemmy.worldMEnglish
        01·
        6 months ago

        Would you apply that logic to a neonazi white supremacist community on Lemmy.world?

          • woelkchen@lemmy.worldMEnglish
            01·
            6 months ago

            you’re fine with sharing spaces with neonazi white supremacists.

            I’m not sharing a space with them when I block them, duh.

            • Deceptichum@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
              21·
              6 months ago

              No, you’re putting a blanket over them and pretending they’re not there any more.

              They would still be active on the site and harming the community at large, you personally would just be blind to it.

              • sudneo@lemmy.worldEnglish
                01·
                6 months ago

                No, you’re putting a blanket over them and pretending they’re not there any more.

                Isn’t defederation the same thing? Users won’t disappear (and they can also create accounts elsewhere…).

                • Deceptichum@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
                  11·
                  6 months ago

                  Blocked users or communities can still interact on the wider site and with you, you just won’t see them.

                  Defederated instances are completely barred from doing so.

                  It’s the difference between plugging your ears when someone else speaks vs locking them out of your house and not letting them get close.

              • woelkchen@lemmy.worldMEnglish
                01·
                6 months ago

                Have your instance block individual communities and users then.

                Blocking entire big-tent instances is “harming the community at large”.

                PS: Have fun on my block list. I’m not discussing any longer with someone who says I’m a neonazi sympathizer.

      • matcha_addict@lemy.lolEnglish
        01·
        6 months ago

        I would indeed say:

        • yep, definitely don’t join it
        • neonazi white supremacist is not the same as Communist
        • Deceptichum@sh.itjust.worksEnglish
          21·
          6 months ago

          Tankie is not the same as communist either. Tankies are genocide denial, authoritarian supporters, who are no better than Nazis.